For DJing- What's your cart of choice?

[stereophile]

There are many out on the market. I'm sure the resident DJs of WS have tried a couple. Many of use have disco, new wave, techno etc. lps in our collection. Was wondering what you'd recommend for each genre or does it matter at all? Pls. post your comments. It will be interesting. Ty in advance.

[JackD201]

Ortofon Concorde Series hands down. This is the DJ standard.

[FlyMe]

Shure White label?

Hmmm Lito will start spinning soon... or are you already spinning.

[arnoldc]

sir jack, may local source nyang ortofon na yan?

at saka dahil p-mount yan, tatanggalin lang headshell tapos kakabit yan?

(may separate thread pala for that)

[JackD201]

Yup, salpak lang

It can be ordered through audioden if I recall. I got mine through my Dance Music source in Canada.

Oo nga baka maging DJ na rin si Doc!

[stereophile]

Was just curious how our resident DJs set-up their rigs. As to carts, I wanted to know what was currently considered tops--Thanks JackD for the input.

Me becoming a spinner? That's kinda like a paradigm shift for me! It's just that there's always something new to pick-up from others. Then again, who knows...DJing might just be my second career Embassy here I come

[MK2]

ortofon sounds good for mixing,trouble is...it jumps when u hit the start/stop button of the 1200 ... i've tried a lot of carts.. but i found myself back to the legendary shure m-447 attached in technics headshell w/aux weight... house djs use ortofon ..turntablist prefer to use m447... m447 is the real thing..from back cueing to scratching. the only thing i love in banana type is ... u can visually see your target on d vynil's groove.. ... it isn't true when anybody say the tracking force of ortofon is tighter than shure. i did a lot of test during playback using banana type..i tap the side of the 1200..ortofon jumps..but in 447...i did a heavier taps,,but it stays on the track...i did this in front of a member of wiredstate user,, if i'm not mistaken,his name was jun... 447 also has a broadcast sound quality... even in "mobile fidelity" vynil recs .... i mean dirty lps.

[stereophile]

This is getting interesting. MK2, thank you for posting your experience with different carts. The Shure M44-7 is a favorite also for many of us who are not into DJing. No comments yet fro aron & menggot...

[JackD201]

Ortofon Concorde Series hands down. This is the DJ standard.

Oooops!!!!!! Apologies MK2.

I should have said the Beatmatcher's standard!!! Nakalimutan ko yung mga turntablists because I haven't seen any of them perform in public in a long time since I don't go to Hiphop clubs. Also, when I do see them they're usually backing up a rock band or something. Sorry DMCers.

Kasi Doc there are two very different arts out there with the Beatmatchers (like Van Dyk, Sanchez, Tiesto, etc) and the Turntablists (DMC crowd). These two disciplines have different equipment requirements and configurations.

In general we (beatmatchers) like a little play and like the push of a slippery mat because when we do long pitch control rides aka babad or have to prep the song on FOH for an incoming one that's too fast or slow, there's less perceptible pitch bending. We hardly ever use the start stop button (Numark provides 2) or break either. Our mixers are different, our standard requirement is a 4-channel (4 phono, 4 line, 2 aux) unit while theirs would be what's called "Battle" mixers. You'll also see turntablist on occasion set up their turntables where the arm is on the upper left corner to give their superfast hands more room and to help speed deck-mixer-deck moves by moving the decks closer together.

The wide bodied 44-7 does give better lateral stability and is thus a better cue tracker than my Concorde Nightclubs, having used both I can attest to that. Since I don't juggle or spin my turntable's cover on my index finger while spinning I'm less likely to bump into my decks anyway so this lateral stability is not an issue for me. There are however scratch specific models from Ortofon and Stanton as well as from Shure none of which I have tried that are all supposed to have set new levels of scratch performance.

What is a curiosity to me is the generalized praise for the 44-7 even in the turntablist world. Pare if yours was just your personal opinion huwag mo na lang ako pansinin baka mali lang basa ko.

I do know that many top turntablist perform using what MK2 calls banana types. Seeing as they are paid to perform (even if they were paid to use the carts being sponsored ), they nonetheless need the same level at least of performance from a 44-7. Hindi naman siguro papayag na tumatalon talon ang sets nila even if they were paid a lot of money. I don't think they'd risk their careers. (Q-Bert is a signed Ortofon artist and uses a "banana" model designed for him and available to the public).

Obviously I'm not the scratch type. I do however have the utmost respect for turntablists and am always in awe of what they can do. It's something more appreciated when seen and not just heard.

[MK2]

yap,they are paid to promote the product,,,its not their choice.... like numark's signature series "carl cox".. why does this gap toothed dj doesnt use ortofon..syempre,paid sya and also libre sa paggamit nun,.. mern kc ako nun,,di ba nag benta ako ng pair na 1200,nagrequest ung buyer na samahan na ng carts,,un ang pinabayaran ko sa kanya,, nag add sya ng 6k... but i bought the pair of that carts for 14k... di ko talaga pinagpalit ung 447,,
acctually one time eh,nagset up ako outdoor using that carts,malakas ang hangin nun,talagang kahit mag adjust ako ng counter weight e,tinatangay..so i decide to put on my 447....it works!.
so i talk to myself.... para ano pa,kinuha ko ba sya for display purposes lang.. ung una ko pa ortofon e isinama ko sa benta ng mk2,i thought na magugustuhan sya ng bumili kc nga mahal un,,after a week,naghahanap n sya ng shure at technics headshell at aux weights.. after some comparison,,he chooses shure...i dont know,maybe he discover something... i really admire of djs using banana types of carts,, but since we have diff experiences,,we can share it to others,,, even if we are not paid to promote the gadgets... hehehe. dapat may bayad un bi ba?

[JackD201]

Tama! Dapat tayo bayaran ng Shure at Ortofon

It really depends on the use. Lalo na for you turntablists na dapat 100% ang kumpyansa. Sa amin convenience and sound character kasi ang priority not tracking. This is another bonus nga pala of Ortofon carts I can go spherical for killer bass or Elliptical for more refinement by just swapping the stylus. In a few seconds good to go again.

For some naman they seem to be able to use anything. Parang that french guy Netik. I looked up the past champions of DMC because of this thread and found the 2006 champ who on youtube uses both headshell mounted and integrated carts. Hayop his drum scratching! I've never seen anybody make two records sound like a fully programmed midi track the way he does.

Si Carl Cox aka Pogi was reportedly paid an obscene amount of money by Numark. That's commerce for you. The top dance DJs command sky high appearance fees kasi they can fill up football stadiums. It goes with the territory I guess. Turntablism is a much smaller market because, sa tingin ko lang, for the most part only fellow DJs can really appreciate the genius of some of these guys.

Now that Club DJs are composing their own songs in greater volume they also reach more people as artists. To find a turntablism CD medjo pahirapan talaga.

BTW, para back on topic.

What force do you use on your 44-7's? Dapat max 3gms lang pero the other Shure scratch carts abot ng 5gms. Are you playing the 44-7's heavy? (kasi you mentioned the extra weights)

What others don't know is that cartridges for Djs are like the turntables themselves. May touch na nakakasanayan. So even if let's say I could go Vestax, may "feel" ang 1200s/1210s na I don't want to part with. For many ganoon din re: the 44-7. Every cart has a "feel" to it mostly from how the cantilever "plays" when cueing (it's a touch and hearing thing, the sound the carts make to the tiny motions of your hand). The 44-7 has a more pliant feel that I can imagine would give better stylus/groove feedback for the scratcher through his headphones. Again, something not terribly important to me. As long as I can cue at high speed and still count my beats to find my release point and be sure my cart isn't gonna fly off the record ok na yun.

[meng-got]

SHURE 447 the probly one of the best and not too costsy..
it was designed for turntablist application such as scratchnig, beat jugging, needle dropping etc. beacause of its sturdy on all circumstances..


sound is good and powerfull too.

sorry doc medyo busy lang ngayon ko lang nakita eto..

[aron]

IMHO

I play white labels when am playing in gigs (very very rarely..hehe) and I use my old reliable 447's at home. I actually use 447's more and more even if i'm playing outside. Its so easy to set-up and a works great even if you set it up a dilapidated war-torn 1200's. I have experienced some difficulty in setting up my white labels on poorly maintained 1200's. The sound is better than the 447's but I can sacrifice abit of the quality instead of working all night to balance the left-right sound in a corroded tonearm contact.

let me put it this way.
The 447's for me, will be my reliable daily driver but the white labels will be worn during my weekend warrior mode.

Have read alot of good reviews on the Ortofons and I envy DJ's who can afford them. But I guess I am no superstar DJ YET..hehe. Baka pag meron na akong sponsor.

Sir Jack. Can you confirm this..heard that the ortofons shave a portion of the vinyls when played repeatedly? Parang nakakapudpod daw? Parang masyado daw siya matalas? Dont know if this is true. Thanks!



sorry for late reply din doc. Been out of the circle for quite sometime kasi busy din.

[JackD201]

Haven't noticed any groove wear of note pare. Siguro in the days of Rick Astley na 10 times in one night ang "Never Gonna Give You Up" delekado yun

Aba gigs na ha? Sikat!!!!

[aron]

Haven't noticed any groove wear of note pare. Siguro in the days of Rick Astley na 10 times in one night ang "Never Gonna Give You Up" delekado yun

Aba gigs na ha? Sikat!!!!

Yeah! I had 3 gigs for the whole year of 2006. Mostly at my friend's house where we all end up banging each others heads because the ladies dont want to come. hehehe. At least the neighbors' maids were swaying to my VST megamixes. Grabe na sikat ko..hehehe

[MK2]

Sir Jack. Can you confirm this..heard that the ortofons shave a portion of the vinyls when played repeatedly? Parang nakakapudpod daw? Parang masyado daw siya matalas? Dont know if this is true. Thanks!



Mga sir,don't just believe to those silver tongue hypesters.. in fact, kahit anong stylus e makagasgas ng groove,it depends upon the users settings and turntabs condition..engrs know their designs.but consumers just taking advantage on name or brand of the products being promoted in commercials...some user doesnt know how to take care of it,, and if the product fails to meet their expectations,,the rumors begin.. manufacturers of course claims their product to be the best to build consumer's trust ..but the fact is ..... THERE ARE SO MANY GOOD PRODUCTS NOWADAYS,,,DESIGNED TO MEET THE STANDARD OF THE LEGENDARY UNITS... MAGANDA LANG CLA TIGNAN,OK RIN NAMAN GAMITIN,,MAHAL NGA LANG.PERO DI NAMAN UN SA PRICE AT LOOK NAGKAKATALO,,,SAN KA PA LALAGAY.TURNTABLES AND ITS ACCESORIES ARE BEING MADE TO PLAY LP'S,2NDARY NA LANG UNG DISPLAY. EVERYTHING W/C EXIST HAS A PURPOSE..PERO IBA PA RIN UNG SIMPLE PERO ROCK... LIVING LEGENDS IKA NGA...SA TUNOG,PILIT TINATAPATAN,NASOBRAHAN PA NGA,,,PERO ASK MO UNG MGA PREVIOUS AT PRESENT USERS NG 447.THEY HAVE NOTHING TO SAY SA 447.NAGAMIT KO NA LAHAT NG BRAND NG CARTRIDGE..AFTER SEVERAL OBSERVATIONS,BALIK AKO SA 447.DI DAHIL SA NKASANAYAN,EH.MERN KASING DI KAYANG GAWIN UNG IBANG BRAND. LIKE,UNG TIBAY ,REPLACEMENT AVAILABILITY ,SA VIBRATIONS,ACCIDENTAL BUMPS NG BOOTH ..PAG PLAY NG MOBILE FIDELITY LP'S.PAG DUMAAN SA PROCCESSOR NG SIGNAL,NA MA-MASK UNG STATIC..MATAAS KC UNG VRMS NG 447 KESA SA MGA GOOD LOOKING GUYS..MY EXPERIENCES KNOW WHAT TO SAY.. DI UN NAKUKUHA SA SABI-SABI... GOOD PM ,,

[mixx]

for me i still prefer the 447 carts, they are like the 1200's of the shure cart line, i had tried and used the whitelabels and i can say they are very detailed, very vibrant yung tunog, the only downside is yung mga pop corns are very detailed din not like with the 447,

[meng-got]

has anybody tried the 44-G?? this is more detailed than the 44-7 lil bit expensive though..


how about the stanton?? dami ko naririnig negative feed back sa brand nato..

[JackD201]

MK2,

Which model of Ortie integrated did you own before? Just curious. I just tried bumping my TT hard last night and mine didn't budge. I played around with my tracking Force and yikes it skated all over the place akala ko mapuputol yung stylus on the strobe ring! I tried again at exactly 3gms using a digital scale and yun rock solid tracking nanaman. Maski anong bangga. Mine is a nightclub elliptical with the narrower cantilever hindi man lang scratch model. Nakakagulat na hangin lang nagskate na yung iyo refund dapat yun.

NOTE: New SL-1200 owners beware. The numbers on the counterweight will not give you an accurate reading. The counterweight must be calibrated with a guage first.

kababayan Meng-got pare ikaw na bahala sa akin sa Bina ha I used stantons in the 90's. Nothing great nothing really bad either. The sound was a bit aggressive at the time. Hindi ko lang alam ngayon. We went back to using 44-7s then and sometimes these really stable Goldring carts that were fat and orange Sheeeesh kalimutan ko yung model. Those were pretty good too.

I switched to integrateds because one time a stylus broke during a party (damaged in transit) and when I yanked it out to replace it, na-disalign because the cart wasn't screwed on properly pala. Buti na lang we always brought a spare cart and shell aside from spare styli. Since then I had a phobia but had no choice but to use shell mounted carts. Finally when integrateds came out, lipat na ako. I have been very happy and do not miss shell carts. I do a lot of alignment and tuning on my other TTs don't want the hassle with my SLs.

To answer Docs question, to this very day I don't know very many DJs that actually even use alignment tools. Panay eyeballing lang sometimes wala man lang protractor. I'm willing to bet that most of the 1200 owners have even lost their Technics overhang and alignment jigs or if bought second hand have never even seen one.

[MK2]

sir, i used to have DJS blue concorde, then NTS-the one with yellow glowing tip. ,ive tried stanton trackmaster 2 SK-black and and discmaster 2.. stanton 505-SK,,
last april lang nabenta ko ung mk2 na pina ads ko d2 sa WS,nung makita ng buyer ung cartriged na (new)carl cox signature series,pati un binayaran nya for 6k/pair,... si jayjay cocgin,ung fat guy na partner ng absinth owner....
among ortofon carts?.. .ang katapat ng 447 eh ung ortofon OM SCRATCH... kasi nga pwedeng magsandwich ng aux headshell weight...deaker kc ako ng slightly used na 1200,kaya pag may dumadating na units from diff.countries eh may kasama pa na cartridge..kaya talagang dumadaan sa kamay ko..bago namin i-dispose ung mga units eh tested na cya... inererestore ko ung orig running codition ng mk2,, kung minsan kaya di nag skip ung stylus sa scratching and accidental bumps e kulang na pivot bearing.,may kalog na ung tone arm-isang factor na pde mo scratch ng pinong pino ung lp na di nag -iiskip. ung nga lang e dapat kumpleto pa ung baearing nun,pero factor din kasi un na madaling maka worn up ng lp at cue points,pero ung nirerefurbished namin e talagang condition from head to toe.dealer kasi ako ng parts ng mk2...if you happen to see the turntable na ni refurbished ko kay sir jun endaya (wiredstate member)(G'morning,sir) .. anyway,you can ask him.and also ung kay menggot,ako din nag align nun,,,, kaya sana wag kayo magduda sa mga nira-rap ko) ..pag dating sa mk2 at di na makaya ng mga techs,try to ask me..part kasi un ng job ko..(NAG FLAGGING PA,NOH)
bye,, see yah,,, i'm getting busy this month(sound system rentals).raket muna ako,daming sponsors ngaung election campaign season... THANK'S MGA SIR.. (ang kulit ko talaga ,noh?)