By-passing power supply with capacitors

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By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby myself » Mon Jun 08, 2009 12:54 pm

It's very expensive. I'm going to by-pass the power supply of my KT-66 power amp with either 0.01 or 0.022 or 0.047 Mundorf gold/silver in oil caps. Than add 2.2 Mundorf silver in oil caps. The original cap for the power supply is a Blackgate heart of music.

Does anyone know the difference between by-passing 0.01/0.022/0.047 on power supply?

Will 0.01 be faster?
Will 0.01 be having better high frequency?
Will 0.047 be having more sound "signature" of the smaller cap?
Will 0.022 be the best in term of speed/HF?

Which one do you think is better?

thanks
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby Jon Agner » Mon Jun 08, 2009 4:12 pm

what do you mean by bypassing the power supply?
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby brady » Mon Jun 08, 2009 5:10 pm

you probably mean by-passing the filter caps in your power supply ...

those Black Gates WKZ are great capacitors. If you're paralleling the two, you probably have 200uF/500v. Just add a 0.22uF. If you're going obsessive, maybe you can add silver mica in the pF values.
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby myself » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:50 am

thanks...i have paralled by-pass the 100mf blackget with 1mf Mundorf silver-in oil...

but i am just wondering wether it is better to add a paralle by-pass of 0.01, 0.022 or 0.047 Mundorf gold/silver in oil.

0.01 gold/silve-in oil definitely will enhance the High and ultra-high BUT:

will 0.022 or 0.047 be better?
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby hypertriode » Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:53 pm

myself wrote:thanks...i have paralled by-pass the 100mf blackget with 1mf Mundorf silver-in oil...

but i am just wondering wether it is better to add a paralle by-pass of 0.01, 0.022 or 0.047 Mundorf gold/silver in oil.

0.01 gold/silve-in oil definitely will enhance the High and ultra-high BUT:

will 0.022 or 0.047 be better?


hi myself,

if i were to do it myself (NPI), for best results (seeing that money-is-no-object for you :) ) triple bypass - 2.2uf (low) + 0.22uf (mid) + 0.01uf (hi) caps of the best (in this instance, the silver/gold/oil) quality 8)
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby myself » Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:35 am

hypertriode wrote:
myself wrote:thanks...i have paralled by-pass the 100mf blackget with 1mf Mundorf silver-in oil...

but i am just wondering wether it is better to add a paralle by-pass of 0.01, 0.022 or 0.047 Mundorf gold/silver in oil.

0.01 gold/silve-in oil definitely will enhance the High and ultra-high BUT:

will 0.022 or 0.047 be better?


hi myself,

if i were to do it myself (NPI), for best results (seeing that money-is-no-object for you :) ) triple bypass - 2.2uf (low) + 0.22uf (mid) + 0.01uf (hi) caps of the best (in this instance, the silver/gold/oil) quality 8)


that's really the best...BUT my situation is---> i have 2 transports, 2 dacs, 2 pre amps, 2 power amps, 2 power plants, 4 speakers(cross-over)---> want also to optimize my return on investment

Mundorf gold/silver in oil(GSO) is extremely expensive...thus i want to buy in bulk either 0.01, 0.022 or 0.047 (all same price) so that i can put them in most of the critical places...(i actually have been using a lot of other caps 0.01, 0.22, 0.47, 2.2, 4.7 etc. musicap/wondercap/rel-cap/mcap supreme)

sorry: i think my question was asked poorly...may i reframe my questions:

If only one small Mundorf GSO cap is allowed to be added to a set of capacitor (specifically 100MF+2.2MF) , for optimum high frequency response...would it be 0.01, 0.022 or 0.047?

(like i said, it seems to me 0.01 is fastest...but 0.022 or 0.047 might have better impact of that one single cap...and the 0.022 and 0.047 added might not have slower response than 0.01 at all...seriously, myself and my friend are thinking ways to test by machine and ears...the above question is also trying to optimize the economical impact)

thanks
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby hypertriode » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:03 am

IME, it's 0.01uf for the high frequencies bro :)
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby brady » Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:52 pm

may I add. locate your by-pass capacitor at the point nearest to the load. for instance, right at the B+ post in the OPT ... or just before the plate load resistor in pre/driver, etc ...
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby qguy » Tue Sep 11, 2012 8:44 am

Reviving an old thread....

In laymans terms what does by pass do to the performance of an amp ?



hypertriode wrote:
myself wrote:thanks...i have paralled by-pass the 100mf blackget with 1mf Mundorf silver-in oil...

but i am just wondering wether it is better to add a paralle by-pass of 0.01, 0.022 or 0.047 Mundorf gold/silver in oil.

0.01 gold/silve-in oil definitely will enhance the High and ultra-high BUT:

will 0.022 or 0.047 be better?


hi myself,

if i were to do it myself (NPI), for best results (seeing that money-is-no-object for you :) ) triple bypass - 2.2uf (low) + 0.22uf (mid) + 0.01uf (hi) caps of the best (in this instance, the silver/gold/oil) quality 8)
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby brady » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:43 am

one uses smaller value caps as by-pass to the high uF caps in the PS to provide a lower Z for high freq to be shunted to ground.
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby qguy » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:57 am

hmmm...yung mas Layman pa dito please ]:)

I am assuming that 2.2 will improve (Louder / More defined ?)the bass and the lower values will improve the highs ? Tama ba ? Do I need to go for more expensive caps or the entry level Mundorf Mcap will do ?

brady wrote:one uses smaller value caps as by-pass to the high uF caps in the PS to provide a lower Z for high freq to be shunted to ground.
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby brady » Wed Sep 12, 2012 6:57 am

capacitors in the power supply prevents AC (mostly 120Hz and its harmonics) (that's the hum and the buzz) from going into the audio circuit. the capacitor directs this AC to the ground, allowing only DC. high frequency "noise" whether from ringing, or the rectification, or whatever, needs a small value capacitor for it to be directed to the ground.

the other use of the capacitor is to maintain voltage during large current draws. this is where you need large capacitance.

hence, to get the best of both worlds, one uses parallel capacitors. black gates and mundorf makes much of their minimal series resistance and series inductance. well... those claims are most likely valid. but i see no harm (except to your wallet...) in adding small value cap, say, 0.01uF to those WKZs.
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby tony » Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:35 am

myself wrote:It's very expensive. I'm going to by-pass the power supply of my KT-66 power amp with either 0.01 or 0.022 or 0.047 Mundorf gold/silver in oil caps. Than add 2.2 Mundorf silver in oil caps. The original cap for the power supply is a Blackgate heart of music.

Does anyone know the difference between by-passing 0.01/0.022/0.047 on power supply?

Will 0.01 be faster?
Will 0.01 be having better high frequency?
Will 0.047 be having more sound "signature" of the smaller cap?
Will 0.022 be the best in term of speed/HF?

Which one do you think is better?

thanks


kung saan ka masaya, yun ang better..... :D
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby tony » Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:40 am

brady wrote:may I add. locate your by-pass capacitor at the point nearest to the load. for instance, right at the B+ post in the OPT ... or just before the plate load resistor in pre/driver, etc ...


agree ako dito.....there was a time when bypass caps were added left and right......nowadays hindi pili na lang.....uso-uso lang yan......."nearest to the load" is the latest school of thought.....

another suggestion, do it in steps and listen for changes, kasi if you did not like what you hear you can always go back.....unlike kung shot-gun approach, at hindi mo nagustuhan, hindi mo na alam kung anong bypass ang dadamputin mo....

pero i have a strong hunch that you will like it, kasi pinaghirapan mo na at ginastusan mo pa, so walang dahilan para magreklamo ka in the end...... :D :D :D

DIY is always like this, it is not so much the outcome but the journey....and the pride that comes with having done something with your own hands.....wlang katapat na pera yan.....be proud..... 8) 8) 8)
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby tony » Wed Sep 12, 2012 7:45 am

qguy wrote:hmmm...yung mas Layman pa dito please ]:)

I am assuming that 2.2 will improve (Louder / More defined ?)the bass and the lower values will improve the highs ? Tama ba ? Do I need to go for more expensive caps or the entry level Mundorf Mcap will do ?

brady wrote:one uses smaller value caps as by-pass to the high uF caps in the PS to provide a lower Z for high freq to be shunted to ground.


why not use a tone control? these amps were engineered to amplify with flat frequency response, i.e. amplify all frequencies equally........so that by adding bypass you are in effect turning your amp into a tone control......
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Re: By-passing power supply with capacitors

Postby brady » Sat Sep 15, 2012 7:57 am

you can also "tone control" at the coupling, whether RC or LC, or at the cathode b y-pass... but that's like designing guy lines or buttress for a shaky house. Why not build it to stand steady in the first place? :)
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