clearaudio or unclear audio

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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby arnoldc » Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:16 am

Koya Derick, napasyal ka! Long time no hear dito ah :lol:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby JackD201 » Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:25 am

Derick, balita ko panay bisikleta mo at Dereck Ramsey na daw ang look-alike mo :D
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby ihatejazz » Sun Oct 03, 2010 7:04 pm

JackD201 wrote:My lesson learned from having both the Stradivari and the Titanium. The $%$^%$*^%$ are tough to set up. So tough that Tatang and MSM could not do it without removing the matapang side. No need for muted delrin platitos or bouncy bouncy tables either! :P :P :P :P Patience however is a virtue and eventually I got it right or rather I found the secret to smooth CA sound even from V1 Flower Children. What is this? I demand royalties from Tatang for the information! Isang free Double Matrix RCM and lifetime supply of cleaning fluid and I will tell all! :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:


Jacko,
The new generation CA (post hammerhead) is arguably the easiest high end cartridge to get perfect alignment and a breeze to set up, even for an aspiring setup guru. With the cantilever exposed it is almost impossible to get it misaligned. Once the stylus is set on the dot and the cantilever aligned to the grids of your favorite alignment protractor, you are almost there. Older folks like me need the aid of a Surefire flashlight and occasional magnifying glass to be doubly sure the cantilever is perfectly parallel with the lines of the grid.
It is no secret that the Clearaudio micro-HD stylus is cut at a Stylus Rake Angle (SRA)of 23degrees.......and to make it easier and user friendly for the stylus to set at the desired 23degrees, I was strongly advised by no less than Peter Suchy, to keep the wand as perfectly parallel to the record surface as possible, to achieve the desired 23degree rake angle. Any deviation such as altering the Vertical Tracking Angle (VTA) will compromise the all important SRA, which is the culprit to a vicious change in the sound.
Dedicated users of Clearaudio cartridges rarely stray away from this valuable bit of information, they thus enjoy the strengths of what the cartridge is capable of achieving.....
Hope this will be of help........
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby m_shoe_maker » Sun Oct 03, 2010 7:48 pm

ihatejazz wrote:
JackD201 wrote:My lesson learned from having both the Stradivari and the Titanium. The $%$^%$*^%$ are tough to set up. So tough that Tatang and MSM could not do it without removing the matapang side. No need for muted delrin platitos or bouncy bouncy tables either! :P :P :P :P Patience however is a virtue and eventually I got it right or rather I found the secret to smooth CA sound even from V1 Flower Children. What is this? I demand royalties from Tatang for the information! Isang free Double Matrix RCM and lifetime supply of cleaning fluid and I will tell all! :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:


Jacko,
The new generation CA (post hammerhead) is arguably the easiest high end cartridge to get perfect alignment and a breeze to set up, even for an aspiring setup guru. With the cantilever exposed it is almost impossible to get it misaligned. Once the stylus is set on the dot and the cantilever aligned to the grids of your favorite alignment protractor, you are almost there. Older folks like me need the aid of a Surefire flashlight and occasional magnifying glass to be doubly sure the cantilever is perfectly parallel with the lines of the grid.
It is no secret that the Clearaudio micro-HD stylus is cut at a Stylus Rake Angle (SRA)of 23degrees.......and to make it easier and user friendly for the stylus to set at the desired 23degrees, I was strongly advised by no less than Peter Suchy, to keep the wand as perfectly parallel to the record surface as possible, to achieve the desired 23degree rake angle. Any deviation such as altering the Vertical Tracking Angle (VTA) will compromise the all important SRA, which is the culprit to a vicious change in the sound.
Dedicated users of Clearaudio cartridges rarely stray away from this valuable bit of information, they thus enjoy the strengths of what the cartridge is capable of achieving.....
Hope this will be of help........


There is really no secret and its not rocket science. ;) Just have and use the correct tools, follow manufacturer's recommended parameters, have guts, steady hands, a good eye, and practice, and eventually almost anyone can align a cartridge properly. :clap: Proof? -> after the Analog 101 Session, a lot have learned how to properly align cartridges. :clap:

Let's not make cartridge alignment some sort of grand elusive art that supposedly "gurus" can only do. ;) Yes, there is some "art" into it wherein one can adopt some personal techniques. But MSM feels its more of a "science" considering there are basic measurements and geometries that have to be followed. :!:

At the end of the day, after properly aligning your cart, it boils down to two things:
1. You like the sound :up: Great! :clap:
2. You don't like the sound :n: Man-Up and have the courage to tell yourself that you made a wrong purchase. :swear:

Oh, there is another thing:
3. "The Psychological Improvement" - Being gullible and believing everything a "guru" tells you, that you forgot all about the sound. The fact that a "guru" touched your rig, suddenly your rig sound mighty good to you. :devil: :lol:

Next thing you know, IHJ will promote his new personal technique of aligning your cart without any tools, and without touching your rig, and all is done via his expensive i-Phone. :lol:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby arnoldc » Sun Oct 03, 2010 8:41 pm

I thought it was the great msm who can align by telepathy :rofl:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby m_shoe_maker » Sun Oct 03, 2010 8:46 pm

arnoldc wrote:I thought it was the great msm who can align by telepathy :rofl:


Yes, MSM can. :geek: IHJ still needs his iPhone. :yawn:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby JackD201 » Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:38 pm

Ah MSM cannot take a joke!

JackD not Guru, not Master but JackD is avid GOLFER. JackD understands cause and effect of shaft torque! JackD should know. He has golfer's elbow because of mis-center hits with low torque, high frequency shafts! Jack D is also blessed with 20-20 vision with good lowlight capability. F1.8 ISO 6400 :D :D :D :@

Also there is no telepathic mystery cure, purely science. Since I am paying for that RCM anyway and Tatang has bad memory because I told him what I did, I will tell all because I am not swapang hehehehehe.

But first some history......

I went to great lengths to tame exactly what the great MSM says in the first post even going as far as using the optional Graham shim with the elastomeric blue dot. This is with my CA Titanium. Still it was not quite enough. Me being me (nerd at heart) I did some investigation.

Observation number 1: The output of the Strad and Titanium V1 is almost double that of any of its natural rivals. The effect.....like going from a 1v output phonostage to a 2v output CD player. Stands to reason "sounds digital" appears on threads all over about CA carts. Of course! In AB comparisons output level alone would suggest this. Nobody has ever mentioned this however probably because big name reviewers of analog gear don't listen to digital much. Results are flawed AB comparisons because of lack of level matching. Oh so basic :headbang:

Observation number 2: Dami daming pakeme about parameters, winding, loading, core material. The BIGGEST determinant of a carts sound is the stylus shape and size. Ask anybody who has had a cart re-tipped by a third party supplier. The smaller the contact area the higher the extension both ways, the higher the articulation but also the less smooth because the larger the contact area the greater the averaging. Kung baga sa digital, tinakbo mo na walang noise shaping. The talas is akin to random quantization noise. That is why spherical styli sound busog but blunt and teeny weeny stylus carts sound ditelyado but more often than not payatot (like Ho Chi Minh) :P The CA line uses what is purported to be the smallest stylus in the world. That is why as Benny says Suchy brother No.3 is very particular about SRA. Kung spherical iyan, mas tolerant. Bottom line. The smaller the stylus the more dedicated the set up must be. Just because it did not sound good after painting by numbers does not mean the cart is bad. :!: So in what areas must more attention be given?

Observation number 3: JackD has boron shafts, CA has boron cantilever. Boron is light and stiff but boron does TWIST. We are getting warmer now. Most evident in a unipivot arm, carts with long cantilevers, not just CAs, will change azimuth once the platter gets moving. The inward pull off the groove will tilt the arm. cueing lever down. People don't notice this because most people don't look for it. Because I have a super easy to adjust azimuth arm (insert free plug for Graham Phantom here :) ) I just happened to notice this by chance. Using the combination of anti-skate and azimuth, I got the stylus to run straight up when the LP was IN MOTION. When not in motion may konting kiling. Bottom line. By the book, is not always right. As Erap says weder, weder lang iyan. Long cantilever pay closer attention to azimuth and anti-skate with unipivot. With gimbal arm, anti-skate is your friend. Long cantilevers do not like dead stop on a blank disc. Give allowance for cantilever twist by allowing some inward drift. In short the lower the anti-skate, the less twisting. Go as low as yu can without causing tracking distortion and error. For linear trackers make sure first and foremost that your table, deck and arm as as close to level as humanly possible. When in doubt use the level app on Tatang's iPhone. Also make sure the rails or air bearings are in tip top operating condition. :D :D :D

The end effect......smooth treble, proportionate body and thanks to the high output super duper bass. Again like I said in the review section of my cart collection. CA carts do not need to be played loud to get the best out of them. By that I mean and meant get past the visual cues of looking at 9 o'clock as easy listening and 12 o'clock as upak on your preamps! Listen for the best level for every piece of music not what looks right on the knobs. With an XV-1s for example 12 would be todo upak on my preamp but it would only be around 10 for the Titanium. Siyempre kung i-dose din yung Titanium tatapang talaga tunog niyan!

So. No need for furry ear muffs. No vedic mysteries.

I want bigger discount for RCM now.
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby ihatejazz » Mon Oct 04, 2010 5:12 am

JackD201 wrote:Ah MSM cannot take a joke!

JackD not Guru, not Master but JackD is avid GOLFER. JackD understands cause and effect of shaft torque! JackD should know. He has golfer's elbow because of mis-center hits with low torque, high frequency shafts! Jack D is also blessed with 20-20 vision with good lowlight capability. F1.8 ISO 6400 :D :D :D :@

Also there is no telepathic mystery cure, purely science. Since I am paying for that RCM anyway and Tatang has bad memory because I told him what I did, I will tell all because I am not swapang hehehehehe.

But first some history......

I went to great lengths to tame exactly what the great MSM says in the first post even going as far as using the optional Graham shim with the elastomeric blue dot. This is with my CA Titanium. Still it was not quite enough. Me being me (nerd at heart) I did some investigation.

Observation number 1: The output of the Strad and Titanium V1 is almost double that of any of its natural rivals. The effect.....like going from a 1v output phonostage to a 2v output CD player. Stands to reason "sounds digital" appears on threads all over about CA carts. Of course! In AB comparisons output level alone would suggest this. Nobody has ever mentioned this however probably because big name reviewers of analog gear don't listen to digital much. Results are flawed AB comparisons because of lack of level matching. Oh so basic :headbang:

Observation number 2: Dami daming pakeme about parameters, winding, loading, core material. The BIGGEST determinant of a carts sound is the stylus shape and size. Ask anybody who has had a cart re-tipped by a third party supplier. The smaller the contact area the higher the extension both ways, the higher the articulation but also the less smooth because the larger the contact area the greater the averaging. Kung baga sa digital, tinakbo mo na walang noise shaping. The talas is akin to random quantization noise. That is why spherical styli sound busog but blunt and teeny weeny stylus carts sound ditelyado but more often than not payatot (like Ho Chi Minh) :P The CA line uses what is purported to be the smallest stylus in the world. That is why as Benny says Suchy brother No.3 is very particular about SRA. Kung spherical iyan, mas tolerant. Bottom line. The smaller the stylus the more dedicated the set up must be. Just because it did not sound good after painting by numbers does not mean the cart is bad. :!: So in what areas must more attention be given?

Observation number 3: JackD has boron shafts, CA has boron cantilever. Boron is light and stiff but boron does TWIST. We are getting warmer now. Most evident in a unipivot arm, carts with long cantilevers, not just CAs, will change azimuth once the platter gets moving. The inward pull off the groove will tilt the arm. cueing lever down. People don't notice this because most people don't look for it. Because I have a super easy to adjust azimuth arm (insert free plug for Graham Phantom here :) ) I just happened to notice this by chance. Using the combination of anti-skate and azimuth, I got the stylus to run straight up when the LP was IN MOTION. When not in motion may konting kiling. Bottom line. By the book, is not always right. As Erap says weder, weder lang iyan. Long cantilever pay closer attention to azimuth and anti-skate with unipivot. With gimbal arm, anti-skate is your friend. Long cantilevers do not like dead stop on a blank disc. Give allowance for cantilever twist by allowing some inward drift. In short the lower the anti-skate, the less twisting. Go as low as yu can without causing tracking distortion and error. For linear trackers make sure first and foremost that your table, deck and arm as as close to level as humanly possible. When in doubt use the level app on Tatang's iPhone. Also make sure the rails or air bearings are in tip top operating condition. :D :D :D

The end effect......smooth treble, proportionate body and thanks to the high output super duper bass. Again like I said in the review section of my cart collection. CA carts do not need to be played loud to get the best out of them. By that I mean and meant get past the visual cues of looking at 9 o'clock as easy listening and 12 o'clock as upak on your preamps! Listen for the best level for every piece of music not what looks right on the knobs. With an XV-1s for example 12 would be todo upak on my preamp but it would only be around 10 for the Titanium. Siyempre kung i-dose din yung Titanium tatapang talaga tunog niyan!

So. No need for furry ear muffs. No vedic mysteries.

I want bigger discount for RCM now.

Yo D Man! :envy: :envy: :envy:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby ihatejazz » Mon Oct 04, 2010 5:17 am

Jack, aren't we lucky we live in this part of the world!
Had we been in another country, MsM/his look-alike, could have us eliminated , disintegrated from the face of this earth!
[b]PIKON :devil: :devil: :devil: [/b] nga pala si Msm!
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby arnoldc » Mon Oct 04, 2010 7:51 am

In my experience, the Transfiguration Axia is even more PITA to set up with my Graham 2.2 compared to Concerto, and Talisman. I almost gave up on this cartridge but the blood money was just too much. When I got it to work on my Graham it was still short of in deep bass, as compared to my current setup with the Clearaudio Tangent.
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby Wye-FI » Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:45 am

Bedroom Eyes wrote:Guys, 2 members (myself & Wye Fi) of the B.A.S.T.O.S boys adores the sound of the Concerto. I have been enjoying mine for years already without the thought of replacing or upgrading it. Just like all of you we do not have hearing impairements and hoping our comments will add luster to the growing reputations of the Concerto. ;)

The 3rd B.A.S.T.O.S member Highlander is saving for this model also. 8)

BTW, This is not a paid testimonial becasue Im hoping to get a big discount on my dream "Aesthetix IO Phono Stage" :D :D



I cannot comment anymore, BE describe how we are satisfied with Concerto singing beautifully in the mountain breeze!!! :lol: 8) :D
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby Wye-FI » Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:57 am

Octaver wrote:
Bedroom Eyes wrote: 8)

BTW, This is not a paid testimonial becasue Im hoping to get a big discount on my dream "Aesthetix IO Phono Stage" :D :D

Image

:clap:


Biglang nabuhay ang Sulsoltant ah, mag upgrade ka na :devil: :devil: :devil:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby JackD201 » Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:25 am

ihatejazz wrote:Jack, aren't we lucky we live in this part of the world!
Had we been in another country, MsM/his look-alike, could have us eliminated , disintegrated from the face of this earth!
[b]PIKON :devil: :devil: :devil: [/b] nga pala si Msm!


Binibiro ko lang. Hindi umaandar na kasi ang suhol ng steyk para lumabas sa lungga niya eh. Pati offer ng pasundo ayaw! Reverse psychology kaya?

Bottom line: Miss ko na si Ho Chi Minh!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby arnoldc » Mon Oct 04, 2010 4:23 pm

Sir Jack, pag sawa ka na dyan sa Boron na clubs mo akin na lang...

Gagawin kong tonearm :rofl:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby Jon Agner » Mon Oct 04, 2010 5:07 pm

JackD201 wrote:
ihatejazz wrote:Jack, aren't we lucky we live in this part of the world!
Had we been in another country, MsM/his look-alike, could have us eliminated , disintegrated from the face of this earth!
[b]PIKON :devil: :devil: :devil: [/b] nga pala si Msm!


Binibiro ko lang. Hindi umaandar na kasi ang suhol ng steyk para lumabas sa lungga niya eh. Pati offer ng pasundo ayaw! Reverse psychology kaya?

Bottom line: Miss ko na si Ho Chi Minh!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)


Mas may dating ata si Nivea girl kesa sa inyo :P :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby m_shoe_maker » Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:00 pm

Ok, here it is (YMMV)… :)


For those who liked the Hammerheads, MSM is confident that you will like the Flower V2s even more. :!: The typical Clearaudio house sound you have grown to love is still there, but with a lot more finesse. :clap:

On the other hand, for those who hate Clearaudio due to your experience with the old Hammerheads, MSM recommends on trying out the Flower V2s. :) MSM can tell you that all the past nasties he encountered with the Hammerheads are greatly minimized, or even gone! :clap:

It is but natural that everyone has their own personal preferences, and it is expected that there would still be unfavourable reviews even for the new Flower V2s. :^) If Clearaudio had just skipped the Hammerheads and came up with the Flower V2s straight away, MSM feels that the brand’s downbeat reputation, would not have come about in the first place. :^)

Yes, it is really hard to believe that the sound of Clearaudio’s current line of moving coils could have such a substantial change. :o MSM for one was very sceptical at first, and he expects the same attitude from previous Hammerhead owners who were not satisfied in the past. :( But for those who have not tried and heard a Clearaudio MC firsthand, and just heard of stories from friends, you owe it to yourselves to erase that impression, have an open mind, and try out the current line of Flower V2s. :!:

So now, the only negative thing about Clearaudio is.....


.....the Philippine Distributor happens to be IHJ! :puke: Booooo!!! :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:

We want more discounts, and more steak and turkey dinner parties to be given by IHJ!!! :rock:

So that's it folks, MSM recommends the Flower V2s, and remember, this is not a shameless plug 'coz MSM is not selling this. ;) MSM has nothing to gain.......

(well, hopefully just more discounts, steak and turkey dinners from IHJ)
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby JackD201 » Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:15 pm

MSM calls it like he sees it........

Kawawa nga Clearaudio dahil kay Tatang :lol:

Ano kaya MSM, kunwari nasira ko si Titanium para pag balik V2 na :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby m_shoe_maker » Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:56 pm

JackD201 wrote:Ano kaya MSM, kunwari nasira ko si Titanium para pag balik V2 na :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


Sabihin mo may distortion - factory defect, kaya dapat palitan for free. :devil: :devil:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby JackD201 » Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:16 pm

Puwede!!!!!!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Re: clearaudio or unclear audio

Postby ihatejazz » Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:44 am

JackD201 wrote:MSM calls it like he sees it........

Kawawa nga Clearaudio dahil kay Tatang :lol:

Ano kaya MSM, kunwari nasira ko si Titanium para pag balik V2 na :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Why not GOLDFINGER V2!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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