keith - the not-so Secret Lair

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On 45s and V-Caps

Postby keith » Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:03 pm

While enjoying my re-discovered newly V-Capped JE Labs 45 SET amp over the last couple of days, a nagging thought persisted. Where do I go from here? How do I push the envelope further for this luscious SET amp?

Enter 45 king, Oldfogey. The gentleman from the south had offered me a pair of RCA-Victor 45s to try out some 2 years ago. I couldn’t pass up the opportunity this time around. So after much sms-ing, the RCAs finally arrived. Out with the Sylvanias and in with the RCAs.

First impression … veeeeery nice. It sounded much better than the Sylvania overall. But within minutes of enjoying, bass started going one note then things started sounding a bit confounded. Let me explain, VenHaus Audio's V-Caps are notorious with their rather long break in period. They take roughly 300 to 400 hours for full break in. My capacitors? They had 3.5 hours on them at that time. Based on previous experience, the V-Caps take you on a roller coaster ride of varying sonic levels. It can go anywhere from detailed to hazy, lush to flat.

Last night was a prime example. Vocals were sounding excellent, bass was right there. I was hearing the 45s in what I can only describe as the most linear way I have ever heard them. Weight and overall balance was just amazing. Borrowing a page from Oldfogey's description of the 45s, they were oh so holographic. And to think the tubes had been in hibernation for years. But as with Murphy's law, things turned for the worse. All of a sudden, the bass bloated, and the pitch started to degrade. Even the sparkle in the high frequencies disappeared. That “bite” that I like during horn passages in big band recordings disappeared too. I was thinking, “what the heck?!?” I later toned down my bass settings in the DB-99s, but it wasn’t helping much. Pretty soon, the soundstage seemed to collapse, with the exception of the vocals which remained right smack in the middle. Feinstein seemed to be singing while the band’s conductor was doing his own thing. In other words, things sounded all over the place.

What I did next was what I learned while breaking in my old TFTT V-Cap modded 2A3 amp, leave it playing and cover your ears.

An hour and a half after, things sounded much better. Still not the blissful sound I heard when the tubes were first put in, but it was getting there. By the 2nd hour, I was glued to the couch. I couldn’t hide my smile as everything just fell into place.

I then played the Naim Antonio Forcione Tears of Joy cd which I last heard in a friend's super system. This time it sounded so different to what I was accustomed to. Suddenly, I was being enveloped by the sound. The midrange playing the guitars and the cello was just so rich and textured. And yet despite all this, the sounds of the percussions, bells and rainstick seemed suspended in the air for what seemed like an eternity. I had forgotten how seductive 45 tubes can be, and I was being taken by this baby on a surreal joy ride.

No folks. Not a drop of alcohol was had by me during this time. But soon enough, being a school/work day, I had to cut my enjoyment short.

So yes, these RCA 45s are the bomb! Oldfogey’s offer of globe RCA 45s for sale has got me thinking now. But owning already 3 pairs of 45s (Philcos, Sylvanias and now RCAs), and this amp seeing the light of day just once every two years or so, it doesn’t make sense. But this hobby of ours never really makes sense, does it? So, yeah, I guess one pair of those RCA globe 45s has my name on it in the near future.

As to the V-Cap CuTFs, they are phenomenal. It’s hard to say how much better they will get with only 7 hours on them now. But based on how the amp sounded at its peak in the last 7 hours, they’ve clearly surpassed the TFTTs. The same clarity and balance as the TFTTs are there in spades, but they add that organic texture in the midrange frequencies that I just love. As Chris VenHaus put it aptly, you connect with the “soul of the music.” I had made an earlier comment in one of my posts that since the introduction of the V-Cap CuTF in this amp, the gain seems to have increased in my SET amp. Correction: I think what I hear is just better balance of frequencies. Even at lower volume levels now, I don’t feel the need to pump up the volume, which really just says it all. My wife last Tuesday asked me to lower the volume, saying my daughter may wake up. I opened my RTA program in my iPhone and showed her I was at just 65-75 db. It was sounding so balanced throughout the frequency range that it just sounded much louder than it really was. Ever have the urge to pump up the volume to feel and get that bass "oomph" in recordings? Well, I haven’t felt the need.

So there you have it, my first impressions on the RCA 45s and the V-Cap CuTF capacitors. I have 393 hours to go before this amp is fully broken in. And to be honest, with my Lamm ML2.1s returning soon, I don't think this amp will reach that targeted 400 hours this year, or next. But right now? Even with the V-Cap roller coaster ride? I can’t really ask for anything more. :rock:

Thanks for reading ...
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby Oldfogey » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:04 pm

Hi Keith, glad that you liked 'em. But, I'll have to take exception to the label "45 king". I'm merely a serf, as the true king is somewhere in San Juan, enjoying his trove of Bordeaux :)
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On 45s and V-Caps

Postby keith » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:50 pm

Oldfogey wrote:Hi Keith, glad that you liked 'em. But, I'll have to take exception to the label "45 king". I'm merely a serf, as the true king is somewhere in San Juan, enjoying his trove of Bordeaux :)


:D :D :D I stand corrected then. May I qualify it then by saying your kingdom lies in the south? ;) :lol:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby JackD201 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:28 pm

Oldfogey wrote:Hi Keith, glad that you liked 'em. But, I'll have to take exception to the label "45 king". I'm merely a serf, as the true king is somewhere in San Juan, enjoying his trove of Bordeaux :)


I want to crash that party :D :D :D

OF, the L2 with Yellow V is next in line to be built. It shouldn't be long until we give them a whirl.
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby Oldfogey » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:18 pm

Jack,

I'm sure you'd be more than welcome to "crash" that party! :) Will let you know when the next session happens.
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Re: JE Labs 45 SET amp revisited

Postby ttommy » Sun Jan 16, 2011 1:05 pm

keith wrote:Suddenly my counter looks tiny without the the massive ML2.1s.
Image


With space to fit a turntable! ;)

Just kidding, really love the clean look, how everything is just so... right. If there was an ikebana for audio gear arrangement, keith, you win the zen master award!
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby keith » Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:45 pm

Tito-san! Arigato Gozaimasu! :bow:

As for the turntable ... hmmmmm. :D

Seriously, the Lamms are reportedly ready for duty. But I opted to put them on indefinite leave for now. I am enjoying the 45s immensely. I am likewise curious as to how they will sound once finally broken in. I've been on a Rostropovich marathon, thanks to JackD, and loving it. The rollercoaster ride of the V-Cap is still there though. :(
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby JackD201 » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:29 am

Image

When will Arthur pull Excalibur out of The Rock?

Sige suhulan kita. Choice of XV-1s, ZYX Airy 3 S plus your analog starter kit that I've been building up for you which includes the DG Requiem and Blue Nile?
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby keith » Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:04 am

JackD201 wrote:Image

When will Arthur pull Excalibur out of The Rock?

Sige suhulan kita. Choice of XV-1s, ZYX Airy 3 S plus your analog starter kit that I've been building up for you which includes the DG Requiem and Blue Nile?
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:


"anal nathrak, uthvas bethud, do che-ol di-enve"
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby jadis » Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:25 am

JackD201 wrote:Image

When will Arthur pull Excalibur out of The Rock?

Sige suhulan kita. Choice of XV-1s, ZYX Airy 3 S plus your analog starter kit that I've been building up for you which includes the DG Requiem and Blue Nile?
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:


Pare, baka pag dinagdag mo ng Philip's Rostro Cello BOX SET, bibigay na si Keith. :lol:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby keith » Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:11 am

jadis wrote:Pare, baka pag dinagdag mo ng Philip's Rostro Cello BOX SET, bibigay na si Keith. :lol:


Too late Phil, Jack gave my daughter a Rostro cello "cd" box set. :lol:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby jadis » Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:13 am

keith wrote:
jadis wrote:Pare, baka pag dinagdag mo ng Philip's Rostro Cello BOX SET, bibigay na si Keith. :lol:


Too late Phil, Jack gave my daughter a Rostro cello "cd" box set. :lol:


:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby JackD201 » Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:37 am

I love Keith pero O.W.N. yun :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby Jon Agner » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:07 pm

jadis wrote:
JackD201 wrote:Image

When will Arthur pull Excalibur out of The Rock?

Sige suhulan kita. Choice of XV-1s, ZYX Airy 3 S plus your analog starter kit that I've been building up for you which includes the DG Requiem and Blue Nile?
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :devil: :devil: :devil: :devil:


Pare, baka pag dinagdag mo ng Philip's Rostro Cello BOX SET, bibigay na si Keith. :lol:


Suhulan niyo ng KILLER BEES ]:) ]:) ]:)
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby keith » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:52 pm

Jon Agner wrote:
Suhulan niyo ng KILLER BEES ]:) ]:) ]:)


CD Jon, wala? :(
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby Jon Agner » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:59 pm

Wala nga ata talagang CD niyan, else, binigyan ka na ni Jack ;)
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby jadis » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:24 pm

Actually, meron sa CD yan...

http://cgi.ebay.com/Airto-Moreira-Gods- ... 2eb237b91a

There is also a CD re-issue, would you believe, released by a company called MELT.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Killer-Bees-Airto-M ... 53e0e7c88d

Of course, the normal 'risks' involved in doing ebay will be there.
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby JackD201 » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:35 pm

Pangit yung CD. LP lang maganda.

:* :* :* :*

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby Jon Agner » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:57 pm

JackD201 wrote:Pangit yung CD. LP lang maganda.

:* :* :* :*

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


tama :!: :!: :!:
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Re: keith - the Secret Lair

Postby keith » Mon Jan 17, 2011 2:25 pm

Kung ganoon, sa "Revenge of the Lair" na lang ako pupunta. Menos gastos. :P Ganda tunog dun.
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