Bogens Galore!

Eico, Fisher, Bogen, Magnavox, Scott, Heathkit, Sherwood, etc...

Bogens Galore!

Postby mozilla » Mon Dec 12, 2005 3:52 pm

Here are some pics of James' Bogen DB-230A for vintage affecionados out there:
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Last edited by mozilla on Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby mozilla » Mon Dec 12, 2005 3:57 pm

Here's a note from an audio nut about these amps:

I have a Bogen db 230 and it kicks. Hugely musical. It is a touch syrupy with NOS tubes. It actually is giving my Audible Illusions/ Dynaco st-70 a run for the money in terms of musical enjoyment. The AI/ Dyna has better resolution but the bogen beats it for tonality and soundstage. ...... The db 230 should be an integrated classic but I fear too few were made to be heard much less survive. With my Fostex horns @100db 1 watt the db 230 just puts performance in the room. The imageing is actually some of the very best I have heard in 35 years of hifi.
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Postby ichabod » Mon Dec 12, 2005 4:50 pm

I have the same in my files just in case someone will ask or verify. I'm glad you posted it here so that others may know. This 230A is tube rectified with a lone GZ34. My other Bogen the 230 is twin rectified with ez81s. These Bogens have 14-15 tubes per amp, said to be David Bogen's answer to hi-end audio around those days during the so-called Golden Age of Audio.

Tried and heard them on those fostex/Omegas and they sound glorious specially on vocals.

Bill Evans by Dave Grusin are some of the best piano tones I've heard -- that's from the 230 Bogen.

I forgot to give the DB 212 front pix. What's in above is its back. This amp is almost mint using 6v6 tubes. Will easily rival magnavox 6v6 for its rich sound courtesy of the tone of the 6v6 tubes. For guitars, specially the "Taylor" it sounds unbelievably real!

Thanks Grant. Just wanted to let out what I failed to say about Bogens on fostex full range drivers that the Bogens keep things sound whole and composed like I haven't heard it from other amps. One time, was at Starbucks and gave my name as Bogen. When I got called people looked at me strangely and scandalously. Folks, it's a local joke for Cebuanos which I can only share with another Cebuano. See you this Xmas!
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Postby mozilla » Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:10 pm

Just added the pic of the other unit I missed earlier.
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Postby ichabod » Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:57 am

The last picture is the Bogen DS 225. Rarely seen on ebay these days. Twin rectified using GZ34s. Power tubes are 7355. Two 12AX7s and one 12Au7. 25 watts rms per side. Sounds good on the fostex single driver speakers. Bogens are known to have well-extended frequency range. Their MO 100; 200 monos are poweful using those 8714 power tubes. From what I gather, they blended well their expertise as first rate PA amp maker with some of the best home audio amps above. Bogen is a U.S. company owned of Lear-Siegler aircraft maker supplier to the military. They're built like a tank, and very conservatively designed according to Joe Rosen, where is this guy? Haven't heard him anymore in the AA.
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Postby mozilla » Tue Dec 13, 2005 9:16 am

I think Joe passed away sometime ago. He's really missed in AA.
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Postby ichabod » Tue Dec 13, 2005 11:28 am

He did! No wonder I haven't seen him posting. One guy who's brutally frank, calls a spade a spade, pulls no punches, and is good at coining names like instead of Heathkit, he calls them "Griefkits." Read of his sad tales about how poorly designed some amps are. And how he learned from them to make better circuits. DIYers I know always ask his opinion about anything under the sun. He's surely missed by those guys. I know you have had one of his wiz applied on your ST 70 together with BenC.
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Postby Tubedude » Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:40 am

Bogen is a sleeper brand of vintage gear. Few people know of the quality and great sound this gear possesses.
The picture of the DB230A shows an 6L6-output tube? My DB230A has a much smaller tube type. I forget what number; it’s like an EL84.
After learning about Bogen from James I have found others here in the States who know respect this little known brand. One of the amps in Terry Cain’s speaker demo room is a Bogen DB230A! He also has a Bogen tuner that he loves.
The 6V6GT Bogen amps are simply outstanding as well. A guy in Hawaii makes a high end PP6V6GT amp called the Music Machine using Bogen iron.
DB130 is a very interesting mono integrated amp. Vacuum Tube Valley has a write-up about it. I’ve noticed they bring good $$ on Epay.
James my friend, thank you for showing this hidden jewel to me.
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Postby vintage_dog » Sun Dec 18, 2005 12:28 pm

they are keepers and hard to comeby these days.

surely a great find james.

the 6v6s to my ears are the octal equivalent of the el84s...very musical. hard to come by an amp using 6v6 one can't love. only 6v6 amp i still have is a magnavox. hmm, i should look for it somewhere in the attic ;-)
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Postby vintage_dog » Sun Dec 18, 2005 12:37 pm

okay, i just saw a bogen 6L6 amp in one of my racks. this is a PA amp which i converted into an amp some 5 years ago. i should give this a listen again..
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Postby ichabod » Mon Dec 19, 2005 8:43 am

Bogen 230 and the 230A use different tube letters. The "A" uses 6AV5s while the "230" uses 6DW5s. I haven't heard the 6AV5s as yet. You're right about the 6DW5s as like the el84 tubes, tall and slender, and same size I think. They're also so somewhat like the 6BM8s.

The 230 which I'm using now on a small Phase Tech speakers (American) indeed sounds good. As I have said a while back, the DS 225, DB 212, and AC 220 Challenger by Bogen are all very good on the fostex/Omega that I have heard from Ferdy's. In my estimation, better than some of the other expensive amps that he has auditioned on the Omegas. I always had that post in mind that Mozilla posted from the AA thread on Bogens and Fostex and would have emailed it to anyone interested, but thanks to Grant that he posted it anyway.

The Bogens have a clear distinct sound, muscled, yet gentle on the ears than most of the vintage sound I've heard. Good soundstage as the man said about the 230.

The mono amps that are sought after from bogen are the MO 100 and MO 200. Great iron they say and well extended. The ones from Stromberg Carlson are the AP 55, and the AP 58 monos. There's only one reason why I like to own some. Good sound! Worth saving them from annihilation specially bogens since not too many appear on "Epay."

My pleasure to share V_D. Least of my concern is to brag about these amps. They only help around with our enjoyment of music.
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Postby vintage_dog » Mon Dec 19, 2005 8:50 am

james, i was corresponding with a friend in the USA about bogens. he owns and loves them as well. this is what he wrote me:

"...Bogen is a very underated company in the Hi Fi world. I have owned many Bogen pieces and have enjoyed them. ..I have a pair of DO 70's...They are quite hard to find mono EL 34 amps from around 56/7.. I also have a pair of HO 10 amps with 6B4 triode output tubes...VERY hard to find amps..I have some integrateds as well..The 130 with the 6AV5 outputs is a very under rated amp..."

he sent me some pics of the DO 70's and they are quite unique with the tubes/chassis on it's side.

congrats on your treaures.
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Postby ichabod » Mon Dec 19, 2005 8:57 am

Well, thanks, and for the post above. I haven't seen any of those amps he mentioned. Never thought David Bogen made amps using el34s. Maybe you can post those pictures for posterity and for those who love bogen sound here. Mang Rod speaks highly of them having stereo-ized a mono MO 200. Big powerful amp with lotsa tubes, and in BLACK like a panzer!

Just to add a little on Bogen sound using 6BM8s, Dan Hayes heard them the first time I think in my place, and commented on its distinct tonality saying that every musical instrument seemed to glow with air (space)around them. A saintly amp ha?
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Postby Tubedude » Mon Dec 19, 2005 11:15 am

ichabod wrote: Dan Hayes heard them the first time I think in my place, and commented on its distinct tonality saying that every musical instrument seemed to glow with air (space)around them. A saintly amp ha?

Exactly, I clearly remember that little guy! I think it was during my first visit to your place James?
Thanks for sharing the Bogen information Grant and Francis. I’ll keep my eyes and ears open if ever I come across them.
Radio Craftsmen C400 mono is the best 6V6 I have in my collection so far. Used with Bendix 5992’s the sound is fantastic! The Bendix is a direct replacement for 6V6GT. By far the best sounding of that type but take forever to warm up. However worth the wait.
Sir James is my role model!
He taught me this very important lesson:
At some point your vintage collection will become large enough to reach critical mass. After that your wife is unable to distinguish new vintage gear from the old stuff!
:)
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Postby ichabod » Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:39 pm

Tubedude, "critical mass" or sheer numbers will get new acquisitions virtually unnoticed. You just have to put them side by side coz the similarities are mesmerizing. Tube magic is it?

Yes that Radio Craftmen I heard with their same McIntosh like Chrome can be overwhelming, so with the Knight KB 85. Dan we still have a long way collecting before we sit in our rocking chairs counting and recounting how they sound on which speakers from which generation, bookshelf, floor, or that QUAD of yours! Boy, I'd need some assistant to even just lift them for a set-up. Maybe all we'll ever have are those precious moments dangling in the inner recessess of our hopefully not so cloudy minds and ears which I hope can still hear their heavenly glory.

I dread that day!
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Postby mozilla » Mon Dec 19, 2005 6:49 pm

Here are how the D070's look like
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Postby ichabod » Tue Dec 20, 2005 8:49 am

Thanks Grant. I've seen some of these color scheme from Bogen, green or emerald finish are also quite common. But the later color scheme takes on some navy gray very industrial looking like the DB 230 and DB 212. I just realize that some 230A models look exactly the same as my 230 using same tubes. But the 230A shown above is I think a later model using a different set of power tubes, 6AV5s. Dan I believe has the same 230A as my 230. Two stands for two 30 watts per side. Hence 230.
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Postby Tubedude » Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:08 pm

ichabod wrote: Two stands for two 30 watts per side. Hence 230.

Yep I think you are correct, as in DB212 the 6V6 would be ~12watts.

Thank you for the picture Grant. Look at the size of that D070 PS transformer!

Bogen was a defense contractor through the 60’s. The build quality was near mil-spec on the early stuff. They also used some of the strangest tubes. I think a lot of thought went into their gear.
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Postby mozilla » Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:57 pm

Hi Dan,

I forgot to mention that the pics of the D070 is courtesy of the yahoo/classicstereo group.
Have you paired your 989's with Bogens?
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Postby ichabod » Wed Dec 21, 2005 8:17 am

"mil-spec'd" is Dan's work at Boeing Co., so I surmise he's talking from experience from the standpoint of military ruggedness. These Bogens, according to Joe Rosen, are designed conservatively and can withstand long use and abuse!

Just hooked up to replace the sherwood 5000 mark II with my Bogen DS 225 driven by a Pas 2 Rivo upgraded preamp, powering a Rogers Studio 3 (again from Rivo's treasured collection). That "Taylor" guitar from Windham HIll collection on "Taylor" just leaps out in all its lively natural vividness! Dan wish you were here. Must be snowing out there a lot in WA? Grant I'll keep this set-up for you to listen. Merry Xmas folks!
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