The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby arnel90 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:25 pm

For those who have a copy, care to share your listening experience? :)
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby retro12195 » Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:15 am

arnel90 wrote:For those who have a copy, care to share your listening experience? :)

+1 :!:
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby dv187736 » Sun Dec 15, 2013 11:26 am

bb3 wrote:
makinao wrote:
Damaged Goods wrote:i hope next time they put extra effort on the covers, since packaging plays an important part in an album release...in my opinion the covers look bootleg themselves...pics,write ups ,etc would be a good come on especially for us collectors.just my 2 cents..

and also double check sa spelling of songs :wasntme:


I'm really not surprised. AFAIK, mainstream recording companies see artwork, liner notes, packaging, even copy editing as nothing more than unnecessary added expenses. Consulting with, and involving the original artist(s), engineers, and producers costs more money. And being fastidious about technical quality costs yet more money.

To me, this rash of vinyl releases is nothing more than jumping on the bandwagon. I see no artistic, creative, nor technological framework driving these projects. All they want is our money. I for one will not give them any of mine.


I may have to agree on makinao on this one.

It is clear that the purveyors of this project are not really record enthusiasts. They fail to see the importance of liner notes, jacket design, etc the way we appreciate and see significance on those things.
An informative and historical perspective of the artist, the recording process, and the reason for this analogue reissue would have been a welcome legacy that the recording company would have left for future generations to appreciate.

I come from the printing/graphic arts industry. Adding liner notes won’t even cause a dent on the P1200 price they are asking. Also, a fine arts student or a budding graphic artist could render a more attractive jacket. Heck, he may even do it for free as long as he’s credited on the album. – I would!
Apparently, the recording company didn’t even consider this avenue; and as stated above, makes this seem like a rush and hurried project just for the sake of the bottom line.

The technicalities involved to produce good sound on these reissues have numerous challenges. I may close my eyes on an inferior sound quality and let it slide. I understand that these are beyond their control.
But I cannot understand why they cannot come up with a packaging befitting the importance of these reissues.
Talagang mukhang binale wala lang.

It seems that the recording company is missing the whole point of these vinyl reissues. This was a chance for them to be that pioneering spirit reintroducing vinyl and ushering the second golden age of analogue here in the country.

This was a chance for them to be a part of local music/recording history.

They blew it.


Its good to have "pioneering spirit" but if the economics of doing the thing is not sustainable, what's the point then? If WS thinks it can produce the right (or better?) product then WS perhaps should take the challenge and be the pioneer.
At least these guys are trying.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby dsoulman73 » Sun Dec 15, 2013 12:27 pm

I may have to agree on makinao on this one.

It is clear that the purveyors of this project are not really record enthusiasts. They fail to see the importance of liner notes, jacket design, etc the way we appreciate and see significance on those things.
An informative and historical perspective of the artist, the recording process, and the reason for this analogue reissue would have been a welcome legacy that the recording company would have left for future generations to appreciate.

I come from the printing/graphic arts industry. Adding liner notes won’t even cause a dent on the P1200 price they are asking. Also, a fine arts student or a budding graphic artist could render a more attractive jacket. Heck, he may even do it for free as long as he’s credited on the album. – I would!
Apparently, the recording company didn’t even consider this avenue; and as stated above, makes this seem like a rush and hurried project just for the sake of the bottom line.

The technicalities involved to produce good sound on these reissues have numerous challenges. I may close my eyes on an inferior sound quality and let it slide. I understand that these are beyond their control.
But I cannot understand why they cannot come up with a packaging befitting the importance of these reissues.
Talagang mukhang binale wala lang.

It seems that the recording company is missing the whole point of these vinyl reissues. This was a chance for them to be that pioneering spirit reintroducing vinyl and ushering the second golden age of analogue here in the country.

This was a chance for them to be a part of local music/recording history.

They blew it.[/quote]

Its good to have "pioneering spirit" but if the economics of doing the thing is not sustainable, what's the point then? If WS thinks it can produce the right (or better?) product then WS perhaps should take the challenge and be the pioneer.
At least these guys are trying.[/quote]

Bro, WS can't..they don't own the songs..the rights and don't have the master...I agree on makinao & BB3 on this one..
WS is already the Pioneer Philippine forum..been reading old post from the early 2000..this forum had already grown since then..
with these polyeast releases..it's not worth my money..but still thinking of buying the dawn and joey albert..hehe..:-) iba pa rin talaga kapag umiikot ang plaka.
sablay din sila sa cd ng the youth re-issue,mukhang hindi galing sa master na dumaan sa board..parang cd copy..yung inlay hindi rin ganun yung cassette ko dati..
may problema nga siguro..my 2 cents lang..pero parang 10 cents..hehe
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby manila » Sun Dec 15, 2013 1:09 pm

arnel90 wrote:For those who have a copy, care to share your listening experience? :)



For the dawn and tf, it is definitely better than bamboo sound quality wise. Id rate it 8/10. True faith sounds slightly better recorded maybe due to it being more current. Only a little lacking sa bass and drums dept but thats just asking too much. Overall im very happy! Looking forward to the next release! Thanks Polyeast!
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby dv187736 » Sun Dec 15, 2013 9:59 pm

dsoulman73 wrote:I may have to agree on makinao on this one.

It is clear that the purveyors of this project are not really record enthusiasts. They fail to see the importance of liner notes, jacket design, etc the way we appreciate and see significance on those things.
An informative and historical perspective of the artist, the recording process, and the reason for this analogue reissue would have been a welcome legacy that the recording company would have left for future generations to appreciate.

I come from the printing/graphic arts industry. Adding liner notes won’t even cause a dent on the P1200 price they are asking. Also, a fine arts student or a budding graphic artist could render a more attractive jacket. Heck, he may even do it for free as long as he’s credited on the album. – I would!
Apparently, the recording company didn’t even consider this avenue; and as stated above, makes this seem like a rush and hurried project just for the sake of the bottom line.

The technicalities involved to produce good sound on these reissues have numerous challenges. I may close my eyes on an inferior sound quality and let it slide. I understand that these are beyond their control.
But I cannot understand why they cannot come up with a packaging befitting the importance of these reissues.
Talagang mukhang binale wala lang.

It seems that the recording company is missing the whole point of these vinyl reissues. This was a chance for them to be that pioneering spirit reintroducing vinyl and ushering the second golden age of analogue here in the country.

This was a chance for them to be a part of local music/recording history.

They blew it.


Its good to have "pioneering spirit" but if the economics of doing the thing is not sustainable, what's the point then? If WS thinks it can produce the right (or better?) product then WS perhaps should take the challenge and be the pioneer.
At least these guys are trying.[/quote]

Bro, WS can't..they don't own the songs..the rights and don't have the master...I agree on makinao & BB3 on this one..
WS is already the Pioneer Philippine forum..been reading old post from the early 2000..this forum had already grown since then..
with these polyeast releases..it's not worth my money..but still thinking of buying the dawn and joey albert..hehe..:-) iba pa rin talaga kapag umiikot ang plaka.
sablay din sila sa cd ng the youth re-issue,mukhang hindi galing sa master na dumaan sa board..parang cd copy..yung inlay hindi rin ganun yung cassette ko dati..
may problema nga siguro..my 2 cents lang..pero parang 10 cents..hehe[/quote]
----------------------------------------------------------

Fully agree with WS already the pioneer and premier audio forum in the country. No doubt about that.

Securing permission to re-issue (?) songs from the owners must be one of the challenges in producing a record, needless to say has to be done. And definitely will be part of the costs.

Perhaps there is a way this can be done. I recall in this forum there was an amplifier challenge where DIYers were encouraged to compete to make the best P35K amp. Not sure how many joined, but in the same manner, perhaps there are many WS members who would want/are willing to do a joint project (ala Kickstarter) to produce an audiophile quality OPM vinyl record. Actually, I think someone has already proposed this in the forum.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby bb3 » Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:59 am

dv187736 wrote:
Its good to have "pioneering spirit" but if the economics of doing the thing is not sustainable, what's the point then? If WS thinks it can produce the right (or better?) product then WS perhaps should take the challenge and be the pioneer.
At least these guys are trying.


I think the economics is sustainable.
Why then would they release these 3 reissues just months after the Martin and Bamboo releases?
From what I hear, there are more titles just around the corner to be reissued.
Methinks they know they’re on to something here and want to cash in, as makinao mentioned, on the bandwagon.

As I posted earlier, I do not underestimate the technical challenges in producing an album to come up with good sound quality.
That is not my expertise and I will not question the costs.

My beef was with regards to the packaging (jacket, liner notes, etc) as others have pointed out.
-The jacket was run in full color so no extra cost would have been added for the same full color print with a well-thought of concept/design.
-Price for liner notes with the following specs:
Size: 12x12 in
Paper Stock: 80 lbs. Bookpaper
Quantity: 500 cps. (I believe this is the quantity of the release)
Color: one color two side print
Process: Offset Printing
Price: P5000 for 500 or P10 each


The recording company bumped up the price from P900 (Martin and Bamboo) to the present P1200 in just a matter of months.
Considering the P300 price increase, It’s kinda hard for me to reconcile that an extra 10 bucks for liner notes would make this project economically unsustainable.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby dnk » Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:29 pm

I had the chance to listen to the dawn greatest last night when a friend, who is also into audio, paid me a visit. We both like the dawn and we were both looking forward to listening to the album for the first time.

The needle dropped and we enjoyed enveloped ideas very much. By the middle of next track (Salamat), we started discussing how the reverbed vocals sounded like it was detached from the rest of the instrumentation, especially the backup vocals. It was at this point when we realized that the previous song sounded a bit similar but neither of us commnted because we were busy enjoying the song. The intro of love will set us free came and it was quite bright and harsh. Much like my experience with digital. We then both agreed to change the record.

Not too good news for OPM but I do not regret handing over 1,200 of my hard eared pesos to polyeast for a piece of The Dawn memorabilia. Unfortunately I don't share the same fanaticism towards the late Kiko, true faith and miss Albert.

Just my P0.90
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby jmyt » Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:49 pm

I bought The Dawn and Francis M yesterday and played them this morning. Comparing to my first two albums of The Dawn (self title) and I Stand with You, back in the 80s, the new LP copy provides a CD listening experience.....the analog sound may seem to be lost somewhere.....
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby makinao » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:41 pm

dnk wrote:The needle dropped and we enjoyed enveloped ideas very much. By the middle of next track (Salamat), we started discussing how the reverbed vocals sounded like it was detached from the rest of the instrumentation, especially the backup vocals. It was at this point when we realized that the previous song sounded a bit similar but neither of us commnted because we were busy enjoying the song. The intro of love will set us free came and it was quite bright and harsh. Much like my experience with digital. We then both agreed to change the record.


The detachment of parts was quite common in the mid to late 1980s. Whereas in the past a studio had one major effect unit like a reverb (usually large plate units the size of a telephone booth, or spring units the size of a refrigerator), the prices of analog, and later digital outboard effects had come down, and studios could afford to buy more of them. Single tracks could be assigned to separate effects units, but engineers/producers were still coming to grips with how to implement multi-effects lines while maintaining the cohesiveness of the mix. By the mid 1990s more engineers and producers had figured this out, and artists, specially bands, wanted a dryer, more cohesive ambience, so you'll hear less of the "cweba" reverb effects by then.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby romeobabao » Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:30 pm

the DAWN album was better than the BAMBOO and FRANCISM albums ...but i have a suspicion that the source tape was a 1/4inch master hence the defeciencies in the low end dept.( the ooomph was there because i tweaked an EQ unit between playbacks and i got the bass i wanted )it could have been improved on if they spent the time remastering the master on a pro mastering house so you could get the great sound on a ruler flat system.plus as mentioned above the cover was lifeless and un-inspired ...no gatefold sleeve that the release deserved ,no pictures and info anywhere ,no history etc.....there was a time in our youth where we had no actual idea what the music was inside the ART of the sleeve and we base the purchase on the beauty of the cover ART.....something that the artist and labels took to later and they made elaborate use of the cover in conjunction with the album concept....employing talented artist to illustrate(journey,YES,ELP,etc...) and to photograph(ohio players,ONJ,Diana ross etc)to grab the buyers attention.....with this release of the OPM albums polyeast is targetting the growing sales market in OPM and had lost the and missed this old marketing tradition ,( i am sure they have heard the story of the PHP10.000.00 per album sealed OPM vinyl sales in the HIFI market )banking on the vinyl buyers for the sales.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby Jon Agner » Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:10 pm

I hope the PolyEast team will take the comments positively, and not think that its because "we are odyopayls" and we are hard to please :) The fact that there's a positive response on the present releases means that somehow, the previous comments were taken note and remedies were undertaken and he vinyl improved.

Like the others, I'm very much into the artwork and liner notes as well. I too like to read trivias and tidbits regarding the music and its recording, which are often part of the liner notes. It's a ritual of mine whenever I play records. A good artwork is attractive to the eyes and can serve as a come-on. Notice how record collectors care for the cover, aside from the vinyl itself? Record collectors value the cover and its artwork as much as the vinyl, as its the artwork that gives the vinyl the identity :) There are even some record collectors that buy records because of the artwork and not the music.

Why not experiment with your new artists and let them have an album release on vinyl? Maybe that will serve as a good start ;) :)

Just my two cents :)
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby pmaligaya » Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:19 pm

We love Filipino music that's why we hope the record companies would treat their products with utmost care.

The latest vinyl release from Arcade Fire contains two records (180g each), in a very nice package, includes download of the songs, but still cheaper than each of the latest reissues from PolyEast: http://www.amazon.com/Reflektor-Arcade- ... 490&sr=1-1
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby sumnerbrowne » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:43 pm

I think it's a good sign that:

1. They indicated the songs on each side of the actual vinyl disc with the latest outing vs the Bamboo and Martin LPs.
2. They made use of a better inner sleeve vs the first 3.
3. They used 1/4 reel tape for the master of the latest outing.

Having said all these, highly encourage them to read the rejoinders in this thread to improve their next outings further.

To quote Bill Gates, the best source of improvements are unhappy customers. From his Business at the Speed of Thought:

1. Focus on your most unhappy customers.

2. Use the technology to gather rich information on their unhappy experiences with your product and to find out what they want you to put into the product.

3. Use technology to drive the news to the right people in hurry.
If you use these three things, you'll turn those draining, bad news experiences into an exhilarating process of improving your product or service. Unhappy customers are always a concern. They're also your greatest opportunity. Adopting a learning posture rather than a negative defensive posture can make customer complaints your best source of significant quality improvements...
- Bill Gates, Business @ the Speed of Thought : Using a Digital Nervous System by Bill Gates, Collins Hemingway (Contributor) , ISBN: 0446525685

Kaizen, Polyeast!
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby dv187736 » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:55 pm

Jon Agner wrote:I hope the PolyEast team will take the comments positively, and not think that its because "we are odyopayls" and we are hard to please :) The fact that there's a positive response on the present releases means that somehow, the previous comments were taken note and remedies were undertaken and he vinyl improved.

Like the others, I'm very much into the artwork and liner notes as well. I too like to read trivias and tidbits regarding the music and its recording, which are often part of the liner notes. It's a ritual of mine whenever I play records. A good artwork is attractive to the eyes and can serve as a come-on. Notice how record collectors care for the cover, aside from the vinyl itself? Record collectors value the cover and its artwork as much as the vinyl, as its the artwork that gives the vinyl the identity :) There are even some record collectors that buy records because of the artwork and not the music.

Why not experiment with your new artists and let them have an album release on vinyl? Maybe that will serve as a good start ;) :)

Just my two cents :)


I referred Polyeast to this thread yesterday morning in their FB so they are aware of the comments, and perhaps give their side on the issue. So far, not feedback.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby sumnerbrowne » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:59 pm

dv187736 wrote:
Jon Agner wrote:I hope the PolyEast team will take the comments positively, and not think that its because "we are odyopayls" and we are hard to please :) The fact that there's a positive response on the present releases means that somehow, the previous comments were taken note and remedies were undertaken and he vinyl improved.

Like the others, I'm very much into the artwork and liner notes as well. I too like to read trivias and tidbits regarding the music and its recording, which are often part of the liner notes. It's a ritual of mine whenever I play records. A good artwork is attractive to the eyes and can serve as a come-on. Notice how record collectors care for the cover, aside from the vinyl itself? Record collectors value the cover and its artwork as much as the vinyl, as its the artwork that gives the vinyl the identity :) There are even some record collectors that buy records because of the artwork and not the music.

Why not experiment with your new artists and let them have an album release on vinyl? Maybe that will serve as a good start ;) :)

Just my two cents :)


I referred Polyeast to this thread yesterday morning in their FB so they are aware of the comments, and perhaps give their side on the issue. So far, not feedback.


The vinyl project director of Polyeast is actually part of WS. His avatar is bat2012.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby sumnerbrowne » Tue Dec 17, 2013 9:51 pm

sumnerbrowne wrote:I think it's a good sign that:

1. They indicated the songs on each side of the actual vinyl disc with the latest outing vs the Bamboo and Martin LPs.
2. They made use of a better inner sleeve vs the first 3.
3. They used 1/4 reel tape for the master of the latest outing.

Having said all these, highly encourage them to read the rejoinders in this thread to improve their next outings further.

To quote Bill Gates, the best source of improvements are unhappy customers. From his Business at the Speed of Thought:

1. Focus on your most unhappy customers.

2. Use the technology to gather rich information on their unhappy experiences with your product and to find out what they want you to put into the product.

3. Use technology to drive the news to the right people in hurry.
If you use these three things, you'll turn those draining, bad news experiences into an exhilarating process of improving your product or service. Unhappy customers are always a concern. They're also your greatest opportunity. Adopting a learning posture rather than a negative defensive posture can make customer complaints your best source of significant quality improvements...
- Bill Gates, Business @ the Speed of Thought : Using a Digital Nervous System by Bill Gates, Collins Hemingway (Contributor) , ISBN: 0446525685

Kaizen, Polyeast!



By the way, credit for discovering the 1/4 inch reel master goes to sound engineer Romy Babao who compared the sound of the Dawn vinyl to his masters of recordings by Rizal Underground and Tropical Depression. From his inference, we managed to get the confirmation of Polyeast that 1/4 inch master reels were used for the Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith.

Romy, hope you could elaborate further on the experiment you did in your studios.

Hope springs eternal.

Next stop, artwork and liner notes?
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby romeobabao » Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:22 pm

i had a feeling with the sound of the DAWN,that the master may had been an analog 1/4" reel.i still have a tascam and an otari 1 inch reel tape machine.i wanted reference so i spooled up the tascam ,connected the TRIO turntable (with the DAWN polyeast)to a mackie big knob,and an KRK expose and a yamaha NS10m and started listening...hmmmm, sounds like 1/4" lacking in the low, the kick with no body,sunken mid and a strident high ....then i put in HEARTS THUNDER( better sound) for a reality check(money well spent on this).....putting back our new DAWN as vinyl source i patched in a NEVE parametric and an SSL stereo compressor to simulate a mastering chain....now this began to sound like what i was hoping for now....just to jolt myself further i had another system with the same big knob and and another pair of KRK expose monitor ,put in an amazing vinyl by TAKING BACK SUNDAY,BLONDIE etc and a few OPMs and other recordings....and A/B them with our new DAWN vinyl.my audio observation is "it could possibly be better" if they had remastered the 2 track in a great mastering house.i did this in an a treated( diffusers and absorption)acoustically flat room,however my speakers were still nearfields so ....anyway after listening to the whole album ,i still truly enjoyed hearing them again on vinyl and even if i had to patch in EQ to get a better sound its truly a great thing ,than having NONE AT ALL(except for a copy of HEARTS THUNDER that is)...and since its still sounded way better than the BAMBOO and FRANCISM albums i say GO GO GO.... polyeast.
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby Damaged Goods » Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:49 pm

FAIL

sayang The Dawn pa naman..80's music icons,they deserve something better di ba?mas ok din sana if they involve the artists with the releases , and mas pinag-isipan yung reissue.but then again, all about business right? :geek: for 700-800 siguro il personally buy a copy..pero for 1200? il save it na lang to wait for an original press.

and please stop releasing GREATEST HITS!!! |-) reissue a proper album for wax's sake! vinyl buyers are actually music lovers and most has deep connection with the artists they like,dig and follow.


P.S: ENVELOPED IDEAS!! not envelope lol
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Re: The Dawn, Joey Albert and True Faith Vinyl Albums

Postby Majorkonig » Wed Dec 18, 2013 7:32 am

Just bought the true faith vinyl. In my honest opinion, almost all of the songs are perfect but I've been listening to the song "Ala ala" and it's quite slower than the usual.
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